Sometimes you just don't know the answer.

laura

with out wanting to sound dramatic... it sounds as though something demonic has attached itself to ? her or the house........ did the dog manage to dig something up in the garden that, now disturbed has been having this effect?

Raymond

I think between me, my medium friend and my druid friend we have tried to any possiblility of a paranormal reason.

My druid friend visits quite regularly as he actually lives very close to the woman.
I know he's taken other people round there without me.
Between all of them they have dowsed the whole area, held various rituals and ceremonies in the house - none of which seem to be having much effect.

In actual fact my druid friend phoned me last week and said he and his grove (grove = a group of druids) were going round there this week to perform a full on exorcism.
I don't know if I'm entirely happy about all this going on with the woman in the mental state she's in. The last thing I think she needs is a bunch of druids in white robes romping about her house waving bits of misteltoe around. I'm going to go along myself anyway, out of curiosity if nothing else. It's not very often you get to see a full druidic ceremony so I'm looking forward to that.

My psycologist friend (as with all the medical people this woman has seen) puts it down to severe depression.
I don't sit very comfortably with that though. Depression, real depression is a dreadful thing, but it can't expalin why a healthy dog suddenly died and it certainly can't explain the weird shadows.

laura

could this women go and stay with a relative.... away from the house to see if her condition improves... surely this could then help to define whether something is with her or not?
i don't know why i want to say this... but i feel there is an object at the house that is holding "whatever" there.?

Raymond

It's certainly a possiblity and I will suggest it when I go back down there this week.

I know she's had quite lengthy stays in hospital though due to this Crohn's Disease, I'm thinking if that were the case then the condition would have eased whilst staying in hospital.

david hobbs

It would seem that this persons problems began AFTER the four shadows were removed by your well meaning friend. The illness and death of the dog were then attributed to the four shadows.....Why?

To me four shadows represents four light sources and balance.

I do not know of the full circumstances or what has been done since but I would consider bringing in the four light sources again and bringing back the balance. You do not know why they were there in the first place and assumed them to be a bad thing.

This is based purely on gut feeling, but maybe it would be worth trying.

Raymond

Anything is worth a try. Another thing I will suggest when I visit later this week.

david hobbs

Raymond

David, the Druid. (He's also called David).

He seems to have taken charge over everything.

david hobbs

Pretty badly from what I can see.

Raymond

Oh now be fair Hobbs. This is a difficult situation for everyone, we're all stumbling in the dark a bit.

For all we know this lady's problems may not be a paranormal one, it may be a medical problem that the so-called medical experts haven't even picked up on. I have to say, at least the Druids are sticking with her. The medical people seem happy enough just to shove some pills in her hand and let het get on with it.

david hobbs

Yes I didn't mean to sound so harsh but i just have a thing about excorcising at the drop of a hat.

It could be medical of course and I do hope that you get the inspiration that you are looking for.

Raymond

I do tend to agree with you actually about the exorcism bit. Personally I have seen nothing to suggest this problem is in any way spirit-based.

But then again I have only met the woman 3 times in the last 9 months, these druids have been going round about 3 times a week and the lady has built up something of a relationship with many of them.

Maybe they've picked up on something I have completely missed.

To be honest I'm happy to be on the sidelines now. I'll freely admit I don't have a clue what's going on here, it's way out of my depth.
But I do want to see it to it's conclusion, whatever that may be. I hate leaving something without having a satisfactory answer.

evergreen

What a perplexing story Raymond I have no idea what is going on with this especially paranormally .. depression can be a huge symptom of crohns disease so I understand why the doctors are taking that approach.. and from what you are saying there appears to be little happening to really turn her state of mind around ......

Why do people think demon surely mediums could do a reading and get some info?? pick up something I do assume you have tried this .. but surely something has come up.... I'm not questioning you more questioning the situation

I would like to know one thing was she working with energy herself? is she a sensitive intuitive person herself?

Raymond

No EG.

Actually that was one of the first questions I asked her. I even asked if she had been dabbling with ouija boards or anything like that and the answer was always no.

To be honest, when I first met her I got the impression she didn't really have a lot of time for spiritual matters. She is (was) a very career-minded sort of woman.
No kids, no real family to speak of, her life was her job.

evergreen

ok that covers that then...... but still there is a presence in the house a looming overbearing feeling of oppression- what would cause a career minded presumably strong minded woman to go down hill so fast ? what does she think has/is happening... surely she must have an opinion?

when i hear/think exorcism I always feel forceful do you think that will be the case??? i don't understand much about them at all, besides the point of course

Raymond

I had a brief conversation about this last night with Mr. Hobbs.

Even though she's a young woman in her mid-40's she just seems to have given up on life. Like very old people sometimes do. There's nothing there. No spark, no glimmer of hope. No will to live.

I'm a nosey bugger. I want to know everything all the time and it really does anger me that I don't even have the slightest clue what's going on here.

If it is a medical problem then at least there's a better chance of a cure. With most biological conditions if you can pinpoint the cause you can pinpoint the cure.

If it's a spiritual thing then I want to know even more. What sort of force or energy can literally destroy a healthy person in this way? How can it be harnessed? How can it be beaten?
Especially after Witches, Druids, Mediums and Reiki Masters have thrown everything they can at it.

Even though I'm not totally convinced an exorcism is what's needed I can understand why they have come to that course of action.
Basically it's the last shout. If this doesn't work then there's little else any of us can do.
We're all quite ready to throw up out hands and leave her fate in the lap of the gods because quite frankly, there's no other choice open to us.

I said to Mr. Hobbs, and I hate myself for saying this - I'm more interested in the cause rather than the cure.
Of course I want this woman to get better, of course I want her to get her life back, but I want to know what this thing is.

I hate not knowing.

swanlady

Your all going to think I,m totally loopy now and I don,t care.

It sounds Identical to the monkey that my brother Robert had clinging to his back for three days I think it was if my memory serves me well.

Ok Raymond.

Can you get a Green Candle that gives off cedar aroma?
Don,t ask me why. I don,t have a bleeding clue. Just being told Green candle with cedar aroma.
and Is there a cupboard in the kitchen or very close to the kitchen?
The thought of this cupboard is causing me to feel palpitations.

Raymond

I can make a green candle that gives off a cedar aroma.

I wonder why you got that? I only ask because cedar is used a lot in magick by native american tribes.
They usually use it to attract money and wealth, also green candles are used by virtually all magickal practicioners in money spells.
Of course, just because a herb or plant is commonly used for a certain thing doesn't mean that's it's only use.

Let me just go and have a quick look in some of my books, hang on...

According to Cunningham's Encyclopedia Of Magickal Herbs:

Cedar: The smoke of the cedar is purifying, and also cures the predeliction of having bad dreams. Twigs of the cedar are burned or smouldered or made into incense.
To cure the head cold they are placed on the hot rocks in sweat baths.
Cedar hung in the home protects it against lightening strikes.
A cedar stick carved into three prongs and placed prongs up outside the house will protect the home against all evil.
A piece of cedar kept in the wallet or purse will attract money and cedar should be used in all money spells.
Cedar can also be used in charm bags to induce psychic vision.

I have some dried cedar. I'll grind it up and make a green candle with some of it and take it with me to the house tomorrow.

I'm so glad I put this story on here now. You've all come up with some wonderful suggestions. Maybe they'll help - maybe they won't, but they're all worth a try.

swanlady

Theres a chant that goes with the green candle. You,ll know the one Raymond. It heals and banishes.
Five times in each room. not four or six. must be five in each room.

whichever room Its in at the time. you,ll be able to smell it. I,ll pm you later.

Raymond

Ok Swanny. Cheers.

Raymond

I'm going round the house later today. Swanny, what's that chant?

Raymond

Bloody hell!

Just got in at half past ten!

This poor woman is going from bad to worse. She's practically given up speaking now.
I was so concerned about her that I was ready to call an ambulance more than once. There's no way she should be at home on her own. My medium friend goes round there about 3 times a day but I think she needs full time care.

The druids did their exorcism but in my opinion it really didn't seem to make a lot of difference. All that stuff you see in films about exorcisms being violent and the victim rolling around screaming is a load of nonsense.
It was actually a very quiet affair with the druids chanting over her mostly.

I made 3 cedar candles Swanny, I made them last night and they were just about set enough to come out of the moulds this morning after a night in the fridge.
I lit one upstairs and two downstairs and went around reciting a clearing chant while the druids did their thing.
You were right about the druids Swanny, they didn't like it one bit that I was doing something different to them - tough.
One of them, a female one said to me "What exactly is it you're doing?"
To which I replied "Minding my own business, what are you doing?"
Bloody cheek!

The druids left about 7:30 and I stayed there with my medium friend while she bathed her.
I just wandered around the house by myself and once again the heavy feeling of depression was just so oppressive. I had to keep going outside just to stop myself feeling too depressed.

I sat in the garden for a while - the place where the four shadows thing happened - and I swear I was being watched. You know when you just have the feeling you're being watched?
I marched down to the end of the garden and stood there in the dark. I felt a presence like nothing I had ever felt before
"Alright you f*cker!" I said "I give up. Whatever you are, whatever you're doing I give up trying to fight you! So if you're so powerful you good for nothing piece of sh*t I dare you to affect me like you've affected Roz, I f*cking dare you!!!"
It was probably the most stupid thing I could have done.

Oh well.

I'll let you know if I start feeling unwell.

swanlady

Raymond

I probably won't be to be honest, well, not in the sense of doing anything there.

I'll probably pop back just to visit the woman from time to time but I meant what I said in the garden, I give up.

It might sound a bit harsh but I think it's better to admit when you're beaten than just keep on fighting for nothing.

ShadowPhoenix

I donno...I didn't read every post, but...it reminds me of something I once read in a buddhist...thing. Something about the soul shattering or splitting or something. I don't know if that were the case, but it could be a likely explanation. Ask her to, before she goes to bed, ask her spirit guides to return the scattered shards of her soul...if this is the case she'll have nightmares the first few nights as those pieces are being retrieved. I've done this and so I know what to expect.

Raymond

You don't think this could be a shadow person attack?

ShadowPhoenix

It could be...but it seemed like it was their physical shadows on the ground that were split. When I see a shadow, I don't see them like that I see them like one would any other person...although they have been known to cast their own shadow even if one cannot actually see IT.

Raymond

I'll tell her to try the thing you suggested. Anything is worth a go at this stage.

I'd be interested to hear more of your 'soul shattering' experience.

david hobbs

There is nothing more frustrating to a witch majician or whatever than feeling powerless to do something.
especially when you are trying to help.

The answers really do have to come from within this lady assuming that she is not suffering from a medical condition,and even that could be helped with the right mindset.

Raymond

Absolutely right.

And that seems to be sorely lacking with her. She's accepted her fate.

You can lead a horse to water...

evergreen

Raymond for what it is worth she i think she will pull through- she needs to hit rock bottom for this to happen.... unfortunately...

david hobbs

beantighe

This really is a dilemma, Raymond, and even after having read all the way through I can't even begin to understand it - there are things here that I have no knowledge of.

The only thing I can think of is, has anyone done any searches on the house itself and the land it's built on? Or done any digging to find out about any previous occupants?

The only thing I can think of that hasn't been mentioned already - and it's a long shot, I know - is that maybe somebody has tried to curse her, she's heard about it and it has played on her mind and so become a self-fulfulling prophesy. I do know it is possible to think oneself ill, just as it's possible to think oneself well by positive mental attitude. The mind has abilities and strengths that are still so little understood.

Raymond

If somebody has cursed her then they're doing with a great deal of determination and it's obviously a on-going curse.

Having done curses myself I know just how much anger, spite and pure hatred is needed to successfully place one.

I can't imagine how anybody could muster so much negative feeling for such a long time.

My friend Eliza is in London next weekend and I've asked her to come round there with me. She exclusively works negative magick so if there is anything like a curse going on, hopefully she will recognise it. Also, she may have some secret weapon up her sleeve that we 'grey' Witches know nothing about.

As for the house, All we know is that an elderly couple lived in the house before her and I've spoken to one of the neighbours and as far as we can make out they didn't have any problems.
The row of houses were built in the 50's and the land itself was allotments before that.

beantighe

How about before that? Going right back?

Raymond

No idea. I suppose I could look into it but unless there's been problems with previous residents or other people in the street I really don't think it will turn up much.

ChildOfChrist

she will die in suffering and her continued suffering will go on for allowing such heathens to try and help her

swanlady

Bravo

sheelanagig

Awww swan Lady I will send healing vibrations your way.

Take no notice of the sadistic vengefull man who proffesses to be Christian.

His God will see he does not love his fellow kind, he know not kindness, we must forgive him his sin of ignorance.

david hobbs

Diana

What's the woman's belief system? Does she beliee in witchcraft? Feng shui? Is she a Christian believer? One should act astarting from what she believes in I think. And perform the kind of ritual that can get faster to her unconscious mind. I wonder, Raymond, how that house looked like? I mean decorations? Was it a happy place, bright and so on or just a gloomy space to live in, colourless and lifeless? By changing that you can change the entire energy of it, and the way it reflects on her.

Raymond

I don't think she has any strong religious beliefs, none that she's ever mentioned anyway.

The house is fairly homely I suppose. She's a very career-minded business woman so there isn't much in the way of fluffy 'girly' bits around.

She's single, no kids and normally works about 11 hours a day so the house is just a place to sleep and get dressed.

She's definately not a home-bird.

evergreen

she sounds exhausted.. in general maybe a wake up call to move in an other direction in life... perhaps she is having a break down in order to reassess where she is going with her life

Raymond

I really do appreciate everyone's comments about this case - I really do, but for me it's the "odd" aspects of it that attract me, namely the four shadows of her and the dog.
If it were soomething as simple as a health concern due to overwork or something liek that, firstly I think all the medicals she's had would have shown something by now and secondly it really doesn't explain the shadows.

I really would love to meet somebody who has seen this four shadows thing before or at least somebody who has heard of it.
I'm sure if I could find a satisfactory explaination to that I could work my way towards a solution to all of this.

Diana

http://www.natural-passages.com/articles/four-chambered-heart.htm

Raymond

Thanks for that Diana. I'll print that off and have a good read later.

Diana

Not sure it has any meaning to the subject discussed but that's all google showed me. :D