david hobbs
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No more no lessApparently, according to some clever bugger their is no more and no less matter in the universe that there has ever been and it will always be so.
If the same is true of consciousness, then what becomes of our consciousness when we die?
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evergreen
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my assumption was that it is our consciousness???
I have some clear memory of being else where... I guess I'll add this lot to that lot????
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david hobbs
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Could you elaborate a bit please Evergreen.
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laura
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mind you.... that could explain alot....there are more people now than there ever has been...so going by that theory we all must have alot less consciousness each, than our ancestors had....! 
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Lilly
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| laura wrote: | | mind you.... that could explain alot....there are more people now than there ever has been...so going by that theory we all must have alot less consciousness each, than our ancestors had....! |
I don't think that consciousness can be measured by atoms and protons,so in my theory it is infinite,also collective.
I, like E.G. feel I have lived in other places,perhaps another planet/dimension?
How can that 'buff' say there are no new things? he obviously doesn't accept evolution, or reincarnation [must be a Baptist] There are new plants and wildlife appearing all the time and man is busy ''cloning'' this and that human/plant/animal.
Bet he doesn't know where bananas came from!
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laura
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| Lilly wrote: |
How can that 'buff' say there are no new things? he obviously doesn't accept evolution, or reincarnation [must be a Baptist] There are new plants and wildlife appearing all the time and man is busy ''cloning'' this and that human/plant/animal.
Bet he doesn't know where bananas came from! |
yes there are new things appearing... but it could be relative to how much is being destroyed? once the world was filled with beautiful vegetation and wildlife... now it's humans and their pets! the amount of matter could be the same...it just doesn't stay in a constant form
as for consciousness? well i suppose this could be infinite.... (but with my small brain, i can't grasp the concept of "infinite".).... so i believe there must be an endpoint somewhere! xx
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beantighe
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Well maybe I'm talking out of my hat (a common occurrence) but isn't it said that all matter was created by a collective consciousness (mind without form) and all other consciousness springs from that? When you think of all the minds that have ever existed and will ever exist, which all had/have consciousness, that consciousness is energy and must be stored somewhere. The ultimate in recycling! I have heard that pure energy cannot be created and it cannot be destroyed, it just is. So maybe the answer is that our consciousness goes back to the Source, whatever you conceive that to be, when we die, pretty much like taking scraps of plasticine and rolling them together into one big ball, which you can then make something else out of.
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david hobbs
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Why do we try to understand nature.
We should worship it.
Prove me wrong.
It is our master no matter how great we think we are.
We are nothing.
We are everything
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beantighe
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That's very profound, David, and I agree with you - mostly.
But I'm not a worshipper, never have been. Nature is awesome, and so much more powerful than we mere humans are, and I have the greatest of respect, admiration and reverence for nature, but I don't worship it. To me, rituals are actions that express that respect. And also, humans are a part of nature too, so we would be worshipping ourselves in that context, which I'm sure you would agree would be ridiculous. At least, I think so.
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david hobbs
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Yes worship was the wrong word.
We should houner it.
Which ever way you view it we are a part of a huge system of life and conscious creation.
Being a part means that IT is us and we are of it.
I suppose that with no separation we houner it by acknowledging the fact that we are able to.
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beantighe
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Yes, I understand what you mean, David, and I quite agree.
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david hobbs
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So where is consciousness?
When we pass does it go back to a big pool of consciousness. Does it only appear when there is a vehicle to carry it, i.e us.
Does it simply vanish when we die?
Does it change into something completely different?
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meiah
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Well you could argue that consciousness is fleeting. I am looking at this, but just now I was admiring a tulip. I am no longer conscious of what I was doing before that, so where has that consciousness gone?
I still have a memory of it, but that memory is not in my consciousness.....it can however be accessed by by consciousness.
All I am conscious of is what is happenning at this moment. This moment changes ( it is only THIS moment for a moment), and is not the same moment as when I started to type this.
Sometimes we share consciousness, when we are looking at the same thing, but because we each experience that thing differently, we are acting as consciousness looking from different perspectives.
We are not that consciousness in ourselves, but we are points from which we experience it. At the time we experience it, it seems to be us, but we have the experience from the consciousness, we are not it.
So when we die, we no longer experience from consciousness ( perhaps. I don't knwo this yet, or I have forgotten it).
Perhaps consciousness is awareness trying to understand itself, or trying to experience something from lots of different perspectives.
Its a thought 
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david hobbs
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I prefer to think that conciousness is total is all and everything, but being experienced from different vantage points.
I think you said something like that
The thing is, why are conjoined identical twins from the same egg so different in their personalities?
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meiah
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Think I just said that in another thread.
If consciousness is experienced from different vantage points, then conjoined twins, being different people ( who happen to be joined), will experience a different view of things, because they different vantage points
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david hobbs
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Yes but would that account for the entirely different personalities?
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laura
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| david hobbs wrote: | | Yes but would that account for the entirely different personalities? |
because they are genetically the same gives them the"potential" to be the same .... but as we all experience things froma different view point ... here enters the freedom of choice.... we choose to act in different ways ..thus the difference in personality!.......this would be my best guess!!
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david hobbs
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It sounds like a good choice to me because it suggests that to a degree we actually have free will.
Then again the differences in personality could perhaps be a good argument for the existence of the soul.
There I said the S word.
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meiah
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Thankyou, Laura. Thats what I was fumbling around for.
What is "soul"?
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david hobbs
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This is a guess but I think that if you conciousness as a blizzard then the blizzard is the whole and the souls are the snowflakes. The blizzard requires wind and air, and space to occupy and be a blizzard.
They, souls/snowflakes, that is, exist as individuals as long as the blizzard lasts, in this case the blizzard lasts for ever,
The snowflakes have a short life and view themselves as individual entities whilst experiencing their short existence, never realising that they are in fact the blizzard.
They eventualy melt and turn to water, and the cycle begins all over again.
In the next blizzard the components are the same but the snowflakes are made of all the parts of all the snowflakes that ever fell before them, and on and on.
Maybe.
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laura
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| david hobbs wrote: | This is a guess but I think that if you conciousness as a blizzard then the blizzard is the whole and the souls are the snowflakes. The blizzard requires wind and air, and space to occupy and be a blizzard.
They, souls/snowflakes, that is, exist as individuals as long as the blizzard lasts, in this case the blizzard lasts for ever,
The snowflakes have a short life and view themselves as individual entities whilst experiencing teir short existence, never realising that they are in fact the blizzard.
They eventualy melt and turn to water, and the cycle begins all over again.
In the next blizzard the components are the same but the snowflakes are made of all the parts of all the snowflakes that ever fell before them, and on and on.
Maybe. |
so ......soul= consciousness+free will ?
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david hobbs
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We shall never know but it seems feasible.
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