Cannabis

david hobbs · Cannabis

Is it just me or do I remember this government bringing in 24 hour drinking.

They are now upgrading cannabis.

I may be wrong on this but I have not seen too many people wanting to fight each other after smoking dope.

You could say that both things are wrong but I know which I would rather see tighter controls on.

But then of course breweries are owned by very rich people.

Waffle King

I personally don't see a problem with Cannabis, i say legalise it, that'll kill crime nationwide

Bravo

I once attended a policy review that had, among others, John Stalker in attendance.

Various people spoke about drugs, and one police officer came up and said:

david hobbs

Bravo

david hobbs

I think I was trying to reconcile the fact that some drugs are legal (alcohol) and some are not.

Why is one Bad, and the other OK legally.

evergreen

The answer is most definately not to legalise dope it would be to pull in the reins on alcohol....

I've seen people smoke dope and go totallly psycho.... a certain mental makeup can be disasterous when mixed wtih dope - leaving these people "out there" for the rest of their lives or living on medication to try to control a medical condition that wouldn't have happened wihtout the dope adn certainly not on alcohol

I agree with this policemans statement Bravo I'd say every heavy drug user I have ever known or worked with started on dope.. they often move on to heavier stuff when they can't get dope and then they are away again but they usually always maintain the dope habit.

Dope is harmful, it does make people agressive. That is a total falsehood that it mellows people out and makes them laid back WHAT rot.. ever seen someone coming down and feeling the withdrawals from cannabis and wanting to beat up the next person who they see...

the proplem with illegal drugs and why they maintain that status is that the effects are there for hours after they have been taken and you only need small amounts to at times induce huge mood/life changing effects.... alcohol is different it can be monitored and measured you can't tell how potent a smoke is until after you have had it and by then you are too off your face to know/realise/care that you certainly don't need any more

Raymond

The problem with cannabis of today is it's a very different substance to the stuff that was puffed in the audience of Woodstock way back when.
The kind of stuff they smoke now (Skunk) is much more potent than the more gentler stuff of years ago.
We simply don't know the long term psycological effects of the drug.
The other problem is just how brazen cannibis users are today. Where I live I often see people walking around the street puffing on a big reefer and that all too familiar 'sweaty sock' smell.
Personally I wouldn't support the legalisation of cannibis. We already have two legal drugs and people can't control themselves with them, even other legal drugs like caffine is now being abused thanks to those dreadful energy drinks.

evergreen

That right Raymond.. not only are you smoking the drug (plant) but you are also taking in the fertilisers chemicals and goodness knows what else has been added to make as much money as possible out of the one plant

Waffle King

You can look at it from this way as well.

It grows from the Earth, like everything else thats good for humans to use/smoke/drink, it comes from the earth, so there for it must be OK to have, maybe the human race is meant to smoke dope, otherwise it wouldn't have been left for us would it? Big Grin

Raymond

Belladonna and Henbane grows from the earth Waff and I really wouldn't recommend you spark either of those up anytime soon.

Your argument fits in well with the 'so long as it's natural it's good' way of thinking, but unfortunately that argument doesn't stand up well.
There are lots of things that grow out of the earth but it doesn't follow they are good for you. Tobacco grows from the earth after all.

It seems we have become a people who cannot moderate themselves. Cannabis is an incredibly useful relaxant and has proven to be useful in cases of extreme artheritis and other medical conditions where muscles are in pain or become stiff, however, like all substances it becomes a problem when it is used for recreational purposes.

Like all herbs and plants Cannabis has it's place in medicinal use, unfortunately people want to use it 'just to get high' which not only de-values it's medicinal uses but makes it difficult for people to obtain who really need the relief of pain that it brings.

Waffle King

Tobacco isn't good for you agreed, i know i smoke it, it's harming my lungs and the rest of my personage, but at the end of the day it's keeping me going quite frankly, cannabis does have it's place in my life aswell, seeing as i might aswell be honest about it, i have a spliff when my knee descides it's time to put me in pain again, and very serious pain at that, it helps, might not be good for you, but it has it's uses you can't denie that, it's not easy to get addicted to it doesn't lead to other drugs (reguardless of what Jer Kyle says) it's a herb, herbs are good, cannabis is healthier then smoking tobacco to, cos it crubs you're smoking cravings, for several hours, which to me is about 10 of my roll ups, but end of the day, it's an oppinion that i think it's good, and your's that it's not so, but if it wasn't so important in everyday societly, you would have the Cannbais party on the MP Bench in London! they're there for the Concervative MP's to get high! why the convervtive party are so wacky about there political ideals! Big Grin

evergreen

The smoke from cannibis does as much if not more damage to your lungs than cigs .. it is a heavy chemical too.. not only does it damage your lungs but your lymph system you blood system your nervous system adn it isnt' taking the pain away it is masking the pain because it is chemically effecting your brain...

now if you worked on your knee to try to rid yoursel fof the inflamation that would be more helpful Waff...

I can tell you that long term the cannibis is having a deterimental effect on your joints ir creates chemial build up in the joints.... and makes you immunie system work on over load so taht you will not only be increasing the inflamation but you will have to work hard to keep any virus or infection at bay... long term cannibis is addictive Waff .. not bringing age into it at all but it is only a matter of time... it makes men impotent and there is a significant drop in sex drive .. wow the list goes on... and I could gone on for ever I am an ex-drug and alcohol worker so yeah I have seen the down side of this drug (as well as others) and there are many many sad stories out there...

I too ahve seen the personal damage in my family my younger brother began to smoke like you at about age 14.. he his now 28 .. he too argued it wasn't addictive.. well guess what he still smokes.. he is addicted and still in denial sayign he can give up when ever he wants... he just doesn' want too... not so true it is very serious withdrawal from cannibis hot adn hot sweats terribel mood swings.. aggressiong it is worse and takes longer to withdraw from than herion... this is the typical cannibis story

it may be natural but then so are snake bites and they only kill you faster

PS ... waff I dont 'think you will be addicted you dont really have that personality type as far as I can tell, but i am serious about your knee .. it is important you get on top oif the inflamation now before arthritis is a normal every day thing for you

Raymond

I have to throw my head back and laugh when I hear the tired old argument that "Cannabis isn't addictive".
I have a very good friend who has a joint like most people have an ordinary cigarette - he has about 15 a day, no I'm not kidding.
Two years ago he and I went on a short weekend break to the Lake District and before we left I found his stash in his luggage that would have seen him through the weekend.
I was livid. I didn't want that crap being smoked around me all weekend. So I put it in my pocket and the first service station we stopped at I promptly threw the lot of it in a ditch.
When he discovered he didn't have his precious 'gear' he hit the roof.
By Saturday evening we were home again because he couldn't find anywhere to get some in the Lakes so we had to come home.
That isn't the behaviour of somebody who isn't addicted.

Frankly Waff I think you're using your knee as an excuse to get high. We all have aches and pains and believe me, when my back goes I would be willing to smoke tarmac if somebody promised it would take the pain away.

Putting any kind of substance or chemical into your body is always bad. Druggie people like to make you think it's ok or "not as bad as..." something else, but at the end of the day smoking anything or having an excess of anything will ultimately create more problems than it solves.

Waffle King

An excuse to get high my arse! if i wanted to get high i'd get high, i'm that kind of person, i don't need an excuse, if i want to drink 2 bottles of scotch before i hit the beer, i'll damn well do it, for the pure fact that i WANT to, with my knee, the doctor actually suggested i try smokeing the weedage and i pay him to tell me that, so yeah. granted in the long run it's gunna do me no good, but at the end of the day, i'm 17 i've got a long life left to live and i'll spend it the way it's intended, thats without kids i might add, so EG, i don't necessarly have to worry about it making my sperm drop, as it's 0% fertile, and thats due to the fact i was involved in a very serious accident thats left me like it.

I smoke the weed to take my pain away, and i don't smoke it very often, maybe once a month at the most, thats not addiction thats recreational use which in my book, is perfectly fine, we might disagree on that, but so far, one joint to 100 of my cigs isn't doing me as much damage as it could, cigs is a different matter, i'm heavly addicted to, if i don't have a cig i go round the twist, if i have a joint i'm perfectly fine, don't affect me, at the end of the day it's my choice, my body my descission, my life, cannabis might not be all that, but it does the perpose i want it to serve, and it does it well, weither or not that makes it a good think is beside the matter, to me, it's a good thing, to you it's bad.

I'm not as wise as the rest of you but with age that'll change hopefully, iv'e mistakes to make and more agruements to waffle about

Raymond

Nobody is saying you don't have the right to do what you like to your own body - we all have the right to drink and smoke whatever we please, and to be perfectly honest I really couldn't give a rat's arse what you do to yourself.
All I'm saying is spare us the "it's not addictive" and the "it's not as bad as" speeches because we all know they're crap arguments and frankly quite insulting to anybody with an ounce of intelligence.

Waffle King

It isn't addictive if used properly, if your a weak minded fool or some kind of t**t, then yeah, give them a ten bag and they'll be set for life (not snipping at anyones personality/family members on this one, shearly for arguments sake) as for the whole "not as bad as" argument it has it's grounds for a good argument, would you rather smoke 20 joints a bad and be as high as a kite, or smoke the equivalent to that which is 80 cigs, now in science, i trust you know what that is Raymond? in cigarette smoke, there is more chemicals and poisons then there is in herbal smoking, so yeah cannabis is healthier, and it's a proven fact, and as for insulting people who have intelligence, you're just practically saying I'm insulting myself, cos i certainly ain't stupid

Raymond

You're still not quite getting the point are you?

Smoking anything is bad for you.

Is that plain enough?

Waffle King

Yes more than clear mate, about as clear as glass, but are you not getting my point from a few posts back?

IF IT WAS THAT BAD THEN WHY IS IT THERE?

evergreen

Waffle King

I'm not taking the debate to heart so to speak but for me to get my points across, i'm using what i've got and what i haven't personally so to speak as i can't really put it anyother way without it, if you get what i mean?

I'd call it personal experiance in the matters at hand, but hey, whatever floats yah boat and what not Big Grin

meiah

Am not going to get involved in this one. I feel both sides very strongly.

Step back one moment.

Mankind has always used drugs, be it hallucinogenic mushrooms, coffee, cacao, cocoa, more recently it has included the natural endorphine rush from exercise etc etc
As with anything, moderation is the thing.

Those with a need that they cannot see a way to satisfy or address in another way are likely to become addicts. Whatever need it fulfills for them will become their reason / justification for their addiction.
It is that that they need to address.

I know that, and yet I am an addict. I smoke
I drink and yet an not an alcoholic.
I drink coffee in moderation.
I used to smoke dope now and then.
I have taken speed, acid, magic mushrooms etc etc etc and did not become addicted.

Sweeping statements do not work here.

Ask instead, should we dictate to people how they live their lives? Should we assume the right to take the choice away from them?

Bravo

Raymond

Very well said Bravo, also, some people really can't control their own lives and need somebody else to do it for them.
I really don't understand why anybody would want to take any form of drug. Apart from the obvious health concerns why would you want to be so out of control of how you behave?

david hobbs

Raymond

I really have no idea.

You could 'sort of' understand it with people who are incredibly unhappy and who don't have many good things in life but then I see people taking drugs who have good jobs, good families and seemingly good lives.

I think it most probably has the same kind of elements as smoking. All these anti-smoking organisations work very hard to get the message across to youngsters that smoking is bad, however no matter how much you try and make it seem a bad thing smoking is (and always was) cool.

It's cool to smoke. It's cool to drink and take drugs, and until we can somehow make it look un-cool I'm afraid people will always do it.

Just a couple of weeks ago there was a survey of under 25's and they were asked who their heroine was, the answers came back overwhelimingly in favour of Amy Winehouse.
We all know she's in a dreadful state and needs desperate help but to the young and simple mind she's dead cool.

david hobbs

I think it must be that people who take drugs are trying to fill a void of some kind.

Waffle King

Raymond

How sad. I feel sorry for you WK. I sincerely hope you find balance in your life soon.

david hobbs

Raymond

The loss of a parent is something I cannot personally comment on. It is something (fortunately) I have not yet experienced. I can only imagine.

However I do know that the answer to living with the pain of loss will never be found at the bottom of a bottle of booze.

I also know that the fact you are aware of why you indulge in all these things WK is half the battle won.

I wish you success for the other half.

Bravo

A lot of people turn to these kind of things in hard times, but unfortunately it only makes things worse. The problems are still there but there are now financial and health problems on top.

Smoking does not in any way 'calm you down', in fact, if anything, it hypes you up a bit. It does give the illusion of calming you down only so far as it takes 5-7 minutes to smoke a king size cigarette....stopping and sitting quietly for 5-7 minutes will calm anyone down. For free, without having to fill yourself full of 600 different chemicals.

Raymond

While I agree with what you say Bravo it has to be remembered that smoking is an incredibly addictive habit and not at all easy to stop.
If only enough help were given to smokers to kick their addiction as is given to say, a herion addict then I'm quite sure more people would quit.

Bravo

I smoked for 18 years, I know exactly how hard (and how easy) it is to stop.