Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 1:08 pm Post subject: Cliffe Fort, Kent
Coalhouse Fort's sister fort across the Thames.
Don't know if it's haunted but it's definately an interesting place.
Thought i would share some pics taken when myself and Mel went exploring last Sunday.
Fascinating place keiron,
Would you know how long the fort has been open to public access, i.e after ww2 I am sensing something henious from late 1950's in the first piccie and two prominent names in gangland crime.
hey, hey naughties back
feels as if it was badly bombed in ww2 and a fighter plane crashed close by (american)
lots of ww2 stuff similar to the beach piccie and a fire. mayhem.
ah well best shut me gob 'cus it's not on the test your skills bit
Do you have memories of Cliffe Fort in previous days?
If so, and you are willing to share them with others, please e-mail me.
Marzipan, who grew up in Cliffe Village in the 1970s, recalls:
I was resident in the village until I got married, I am now 36! Doesn't sound very old, but the marshes were changing. In the summers, the flamingoes arrived. I know that around '74 there were vast numbers, and they came back most years.
There were also wildcats that lived on the marshes. Of course, there were always stories of wild beasts. It seems that the stories were true, I myself having seen a lynx when I was around 9.
We used to be able to go into the fort, because Blue Circle wasn't that bothered about going to check during the days. I think many of us village kids were banned after a few minor accidents in the nights, but as more people came in from the town, the police were called out to the fort on many balmy summer evenings. I know in the early '80's, when the fort was closed, there was a fatal accident out there, with some lads on motorbikes trying to do acrobatics. Very sad occasion.
Because of the extent of some of the fort, we used to go camping round there, a whole group of parents and kids, all in different tents, caravans and camper wagons. We used to have fun playing in the fort, and down the tunnels. This was '69 up to '73. The local school used to take us down, to frog spawn and pick bullrushes, and there was always a large supply of chalk for sculpting.
We used to go swimming off 'the pipes', which are out in one of the waterways, although we knew that Blue Circle owned it, and our parents told us it was dangerous.
Marzipan is one of a number of people who have seen flamingoes on Cliffe pools, although they are not native birds. Chris Bradshaw, of North Kent Birding, provides this explanation:
Flamingoes have been seen in the Cliffe area on and off for many years (since the mid-70's at least), although I was not aware of them having been seen recently. The flamingoes are not wild, but are escaped birds from captivity or just possibly birds that have arrived from feral (i.e. escaped birds that now live in the wild) populations in Germany/Holland.
Maxeen Kimber recalls the Fort thirty years ago:
I used to go there with a group of friends, probably around 1977/8/9 and later with a photographer about 1980ish. Most of the lads hailed from Cliffe, which is probably why we chose the fort. My memories are of some large doors to the fort which I don't think were in use; we generally used a way in via the beach, up onto the first storey roof and jumping in through a hatch into the building. Those dark interiors will always stay with me. The eerie offshoot passages, filled with water, dark and forbidding - scary stuff for teenagers and adults alike! And the echoes! We roamed around the fort - I think we camped out within the central grassy area overnight once - I can't remember exactly, but I remember the group of friends very well, and have photos somewhere of us reclining in the darkness within the fort - illicit kisses well away from parents! On the lower floor, ground level, there was a sort of open-sided 'room', just off the central area with huge, corroded, iron, hollow balls in - I presume for some kind of floating device for the river. Not sure why I remember them, but I do.
In about 1980, I waxed lyrical about the photo opportunities of that area and succeeded in getting a photographer to come along and take photos of me there. I had a few petty beauty titles in the area, and he was happy to take some shots. On the occasion we went to the fort - there was more in store than we reckoned on. A gold Mercedes car was immersed in the shallow water on the beach (how did it get there?) and we took some memorable shots with me perched ridiculously on the top of the roof - I remember having to get off sharpish as the tide came in! I'm not sure what happened to those photos, I don't have them now sadly.
Lloyd Clayton also remembers the Fort in the late 70s and early 80s:
Brought back great memories of my childhood, seeing the pictures of the fort again. Having grown up in Cliffe village, me and friends were always playing in the fort. We could in those days either squeeze through the chained gates or climb up via a rope by the "lookout turret". We also ventured down many of the long dark tunnels and rooms, holding dim torches or even candles! There was always talk of secret tunnels.
We also used to play on the old ship - climbing up to the deck (which was dangerous and holey even then!)
Tom Lyons has more recent recollections:
I first happened on Cliffe Fort in 1986. I had no idea that these places existed at all, in fact I did not know the area of Cliffe until I stumbled upon it, and being from London I did find it rather strange, very forlorn is the word I can think of. I recall cycling from South Norwood to Cliffe, then having to take shelter for a few hours from the rain in one of the concrete shelters along Salt Lane, just across the road that leads to Cliffe Fort. I eventually got away around 7pm of that day back in March 1998, and arrived back in South Norwood a few hours later. I must take a ride out there again soon, perhaps when the summer starts up.
I was quite taken with Cliffe Fort, what a solid building it is. I did manage to get into it a few times through the wire fencing, and explore most of it, however there are a couple of dangerous looking holes that one hopes never to fall into within the fort itself.
At Coalhouse Fort there is an aviation museum with many WWII aircraft wreckages that crashed in the surrounding area including many american planes too.
Quote:
Allan Green has kindly provided the following information on the Hans Egede:
"I often wondered what the vessel was and it was not until last year, when back in the village for a visit, that I came across a book "A Pictorial History of Cooling and Cliffe" by Allan Cherry, published by Martins News of 168 Church Street, Cliffe, and found the answer.
"The vessel is the Hans Egede. A wooden, auxiliary 3-masted vessel, built in 1922 by J. Th. Jorgensen at Thuro, Denmark. Apparently, she was reported damaged by fire 13/4' west of the North Hinder light vessel on the 21st August 1955. She was towed to Dover where the fire was extinguished. In 1957 she passed into the ownership of the Atlas Diesel Co. and was towed out of Dover by the tug Westercock. She then spent some years in the Medway as a coal and/or grain hulk.
"She was then towed to Cubits Town on the Thames. Unfortunately, as the tug Fossa from Gravesend was towing her up Sea Reach the strain on the structure, which had become weakened over the years, proved too much causing her to take in water and sink. After grounding on the Blyth Sands she was beached at Cliffe.
"In the book there is a picture of her under sail at sea."
Yes, you have to park your car up and walk a good mile to it though.
It's owned by a cement works.
Unfortunately you cannot gain access to the inside of the fort although most people i have spoken to have. I would say that it's not a good idea as the forts are quite dangerous.
I have to say i am getting quite a facination with these forts.
I'm currently learning the history of Coalhouse and surrounding forts so i can become a guide on open days.
Trouble is i have such a bad memory! lol
For those interested, there is a third fort.
Shornemead Fort.
When i say a third, the was something like 76 forts commissioned in the South, to protect us against a French invasion.
But Coalhouse, Cliffe and Shornemead were purposely built to protect the lower Thames estuary and create a three way cross fire to repel enemy ships trying to sail up the Thames and into London.
Unfotunately the Army blew up Shornemead practising demolition explosives in the 50's and only the front of it survives to this day.
Probably as the construction of the casemates(front) was made from 14 feet of solid granite.
For anyone interested, between 1865 - 1871 the three forts, Coalhouse, Cliffe, and Shornemead, known as the "lower Thames project" were under the overall command during construction by Col. Charles Gordon.
Later known as "Gordon of Khartoum"
Allan Green has kindly provided the following information on the Hans Egede:
"I often wondered what the vessel was and it was not until last year, when back in the village for a visit, that I came across a book "A Pictorial History of Cooling and Cliffe" by Allan Cherry, published by Martins News of 168 Church Street, Cliffe, and found the answer.
"The vessel is the Hans Egede. A wooden, auxiliary 3-masted vessel, built in 1922 by J. Th. Jorgensen at Thuro, Denmark. Apparently, she was reported damaged by fire 13/4' west of the North Hinder light vessel on the 21st August 1955. She was towed to Dover where the fire was extinguished. In 1957 she passed into the ownership of the Atlas Diesel Co. and was towed out of Dover by the tug Westercock. She then spent some years in the Medway as a coal and/or grain hulk.
"She was then towed to Cubits Town on the Thames. Unfortunately, as the tug Fossa from Gravesend was towing her up Sea Reach the strain on the structure, which had become weakened over the years, proved too much causing her to take in water and sink. After grounding on the Blyth Sands she was beached at Cliffe.
"In the book there is a picture of her under sail at sea."
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